Subject: Re: [vserver] Roadmap and Future ...
From: randall <randall@songshu.org>
Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 10:42:57 +0100

Dallas Kashuba wrote:
>
> On Feb 28, 2009, at 1:09 AM, Herbert Poetzl wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 11:35:22PM +0000, Ed W wrote:
>>> Dallas Kashuba wrote:
>>>> Assuming, an updated website is deemed worth the time and effort (I'm
>>>> not convinced it is, but it couldn't hurt)...
>>>
>>> Everyone seems to be trying to redevelop what site we have already - I
>>> think I was misunderstood on this point.  Please lets keep all our
>>> current docs, but add a fancy front end for all the "what is vserver 
>>> all
>>> about" type content..
>>>
>>>> I agree that wordpress might be a good choice for the basic website.
>>>> We are using it for the website of our own open-source project, using
>>>> an 'off the shelf' theme with some minor modifications:
>>>>
>>>> http://ceph.newdream.net/
>>
>> please don't get me wrong, the input is very appreciated,
>> but I don not see that a great difference between this
>> site/page and http://linux-vserver.org, except for the
>> fact that the page is way to long ...
>>
>> I see a simple (granted nicely colored) icon, the sidebar
>> with a lot of (partially unsorted) links and a content
>> area, here containing postings (for us it contains the
>> versions, which might not be the best idea, I agree)
>
>
> I'll just say up front I don't have any issues with the aesthetic look 
> of the current website. Somebody mentioned wordpress and I offered up 
> the ceph page as an example of another open source project with a 
> working wordpress site with a theme, that simply links to a mediawiki 
> install.  A theme with wordpress gives you an instant 'design' without 
> much or any work.
>
> The actual length of the page is entirely based on whether or not you 
> default to showing the 'blog' portion of the site or another page, and 
> of course you can choose how many posts to show on the page at once 
> and you can decide how much of each post is shown.  All that said, 
> it's pretty much the 'blog way' to show a lot of content on each page 
> because bandwidth is now cheap and time spent clicking links is not.  
> It used to bug me but I've either become complacent or I've come over 
> to agree... I'm not sure which.
>
>
>>>> We are just linking out to the mediawiki wiki rather than making any
>>>> attempt to incorporate it into wordpress.
>>
>>> Cool - do you have the ability to offer vserver something similar for
>>> the front site?
>>
>> so, what am I missing here?
>> this is curiosity not sarcasm, really :)
>>
>> TIA,
>> Herbert
>
>
> One key aspect of having a 'news' or 'blog' section front and center 
> is it gives the immediate impression that the project is making 
> regular progress.  I think that's a good thing, in general.
>
> That can be done entirely within the existing mediawiki install, 
> though.  I feel like all of this energy people are building up would 
> be best put towards just updating and organizing the existing wiki, 
> continuing the importing of the old wiki, and other things of that 
> nature.
>
>
> You may not be really missing anything.  I don't personally think the 
> linux-vserver.org site needs to change the software its using 
> (mediawiki is quite nice, in my opinion) or its visual look.  I do 
> think the content could be organized better, but I'm also not sure 
> that in of itself would really do anything much to solve the financial 
> situation you started this thread with.  I guess the theory is a more 
> modern website would attract more users, which would attract more 
> developers, which would help you keep the project moving forward.
>
> All that said, I think it's possible that a different website engine 
> would perhaps provide a more flexible platform and potentially allow 
> more people to keep the site updated and 'fresh' feeling.
>
>     Dallas
>
there is very little wrong with the wiki, problem is google.... let me 
explain.

personally i studied economics and law and work for a company that 
trades waste paper and plastics to China,  computer stuff is just a 
hobby that skyrocketed 5 years ago after being computer shy all my life 
(except for those old games on the commodore 64).
i do not consider myself an expert but I'm happy to be proficient now as 
a user being able to setup anything i want or would ever need, basically 
learning everything i know at the "google university"
now.... VServer is one of the tools that stuck with me as a standard 
tool but it took me a long long way to find it, i have tried ALL the 
other ones first before giving VServer a shot, want to know why VServer 
was my last desperate attempt to see if it was the solution for me?

just pretend not to know VServer and try googling for it, personally i 
use debian and what does google give me

when i search, debian vserver
except for one current link, the first page is filled with debian sarge 
and kernel 2.4

when searching for, vserver
 we get some retro looking pages from the nineties, nothing wrong since 
the info is still valid but it does not look actively supported that way.

funnily enough searching, vserver lenny , vserver hylafax , vserver 
zimbra , vserver avantfax
i even see my personal pages on the first page, go figure.

To have a new front-site is not going to perform magic on its own, but 
it might do some good.
Making the activity on the mailing list visible to the outside world 
would do some good.
Also updating the distro specific doc's on the wiki should be a 
priority, lets take ubuntu as an example.

if you look at this page (its one of the better ones) its a very good 
start but still looks shabby and experimental.
http://linux-vserver.org/Installation_on_Ubuntu

if you would update it to show repeated detailed instructions for each 
release like on this page for example, it would boost a lot more 
confidence that the road is already paved and its guaranteed to work for 
you.
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Medibuntu#Adding%20the%20Repositories

the ubuntu wiki on VServer is outdated, is edgy still supported? don't 
think so.
http://linux-vserver.org/Installation_on_Ubuntu


If the goal is to expand the user base, then you have to spoon feed the 
documentation for new users.
I think VServer is lacking there in that aspect, but its a bug that can 
be fixed by the non-developers, personally as a free-loading user 
without any programming experience i would be glad to donate a little 
time on that, pretty sure that i will not be the only one, maybe 
everyone could drop a mail to the documentation folks for their specific 
distro to update the documentation or do it yourself, not sure how many 
people actually are on this mailing list so maybe even requesting this 
on a distro forum would spur some enthusiasm.

http://linux-vserver.org/Teams_and_Projects
maybe we could have some volunteers to form a publicity team.
Basic tasks as a start could be

to coordinate the VServer wiki pages about the distro WITH the distro 
wiki pages about VServer.
submitting VServer articles on howtoforge.com etc.. etc....

any one interested?

-- 

www.songshu.org
Just another collection of nuts